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Liquid to solid

Liquid to solid

Postby Rioferox » Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:47 pm

Lets say we have unbreakable box, we fill it up with water and close it, box starts to shrink, therefore it puts water under high pressure would liquid (water or any other) at some turn into solid if only under that pressure, not affected by anything else? Remember, box cannot break and it can shrink infinitely.
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Re: Liquid to solid

Postby inertron » Sun Apr 16, 2017 6:12 pm

Under extreme pressure and heat, the bonds holding the atoms together in the molecules destabilize, allowing the ions to spin in place like a form of brownian motion that doesn't generate pressure. Presumably, if you began cooling water/steam in such a state, the bonds would restabilize at some point and cause a sudden jump in pressure. Of course, I'm not sure how you would go on heating water if the bonds were destabilized in this way, since the electrons would presumably not transfer any received energy to the ions. Probably the substance would behave in some kind of super-conductive way, though I'm not sure how it would conduct energy away; maybe by blackbody radiation?
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Re: Liquid to solid

Postby Good Elf » Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:51 am

[@Rioferox: & @inertron:
Rioferox wrote:Lets say we have unbreakable box, we fill it up with water and close it, box starts to shrink, therefore it puts water under high pressure would liquid (water or any other) at some turn into solid if only under that pressure, not affected by anything else? Remember, box cannot break and it can shrink infinitely.
Warning this is very controversial: It may be of interest that a thread exists here that deals with one aspect of this problem. See: Metallic Hydrogen has been created If you want to acquire a preprint you may try here: https://ttasneem.yolasite.com/resources/013017%20Metallic%20Hydrogen%20Article.pdf. This site is unknown but I was able to get it there at this moment of posting.

This image from the Science paper, exists on John's site as well.:

Image
Squeezing water, carbon, and other stuff...

Squeezing stuff using diamond anvils has been around for a couple of decades. It has long been possible to create perfect single one carat and larger perfect crystal diamonds by squeezing pure carbon (like Superman did when he wanted to make a ring for Lois in the comic books)... and other amazing tricks. Long term investment in clear perfect natural diamonds is a little shaky IMHO, but is the commodity of choice for Drug Smugglers, try rare postage stamps instead, they are prettier and easier to carry with you anywhere.. he he he! Just joking folks. It is possible to squeeze "water" to make it form Ice VI and VII and other possible states . See: Ice structures, patterns, and processes: A view across the ice-fields
or this:
Recent advances in high-pressure science and technology - Jan 2016
or this:
Crystallization of water in a dynamic diamond-anvil cell: Evidence for ice VII-like local order in supercompressed water - Oct 2006 This event occurred at about 3 Gpa pressure in a diamond anvil. See: Wikipedia - Ice VII

However the "best trick" and the most difficult to do this with is hydrogen gas... the primordial stuff of the entire Universe. The process which is accomplished through the use of a specially modified diamond anvil "appears" to fabricate small quantities of metallic room temperature hydrogen. The pressure phase diagram series of gas, liquid and solid is followed by "metal" (see illustration). Soon after these photos were taken and the paper already gone off to print, the diamond anvil "apparently" shattered under the immense stress while being probed with a "weak" laser. IMO... No doubt it did. Since then the tiny sample about the dimensions of the thickness of a human hair "disappeared" in a shower of dust and metal fragments. Here is where this story becomes interesting... people, I mean some scientists, are now beginning to doubt the story ever happened at all. In this Post Trump World of "alternative truth", everything is being questioned and it is not just the value of our religious beliefs. Science has it's own stories too. It never happened according to a number of "doubting-Thomases". As the counter-story goes ... This event never happened, "these are not the droids you are seeking" and "nothing to see here... move along"! (obligatory Jedi wave), it's another "Fake Moon Landing", the broken anvil is a cover up. See:
Comment on Observation of the Wigner-Huntington transition to metallic hydrogen
Alexander F. Goncharov, Viktor V. Struzhkin (Geophysical Laboratory, Carnegie Institution of Washington, DC)
A recent paper of Dias and Silvera (DS) reports on production of metallic hydrogen in a diamond anvil cell at 495 GPa at 5.5 and 83 K. The results are implied to have a great impact on energy and rocketry. Here we argue that the presented (very scarce) results are contradictory with the presented experimental description making their claims unsupported experimentally. Moreover, the proposed implications are highly speculative making this paper very confusing for a broad audience. Elucidating the claims and the related implications is important for building a coherent picture that is currently emerging as the results of theoretical calculations at various levels and experimental investigations employing static and dynamic compression techniques. There is no doubt that hydrogen metallizes at high pressures. But this does not make all claims about reaching this state immediately valid. Scientific community would like to learn at what conditions hydrogen metallizes, what is the nature of the conducting state and its properties (e.g. superconductivity). Here we argue that the presented data do not provide any reliable information on this.
These guys at Carnegie are calling the original paper "B**ls**t. Pretty tough talk. The guys in the original paper "slipped and fell", and the pack will surely descend on them and devour them unless they come up with a "cunning plan".

So why don't these original experimentalists, Dias and Silvera, just do it all again?... Has anyone got one of these special and virtually unique anvils laying around in the Harvard University Basement? "Oops that was my last (and only) anvil". The work has to be restarted/rebuilt and repeated to prove/disprove if, the experiment as reported in Science, ever happened at all. Personally I don't doubt it, it was sitting around for quite a long time "under pressure", a couple of months I believe (I haven't "fact checked" that, what would be the point?). The materials the anvil was made from probably recrystallized under pressure and then shattered. We are talking nearly 500 Gpa (about 5,000,000 atmospheres pressure) Or perhaps the team saw that what was in the anvil was not metallic hydrogen at all, but "something else".... bleh!?

Some really interesting facts about metallic hydrogen.
For those interested, according to as yet untested theory, metallic hydrogen is quasi-stable at room temperature and pressure and technically this strange substance could be held in your hand... for a while at least. It is also supposed to be the most efficient chemical rocket fuel in existence. It also has the theoretical fabled property of being the first "stable" true room temperature superconductor on our planet... do you get it? -true room temperature - magic pixidust tinkerbell would love to have a bag of right now... maybe the only stable superconductor ever (maybe it's properties can't be replicated in any other way). This "prize" is hotly contested by rival workers in the field elsewhere in the world. The metallic state becomes quantum self-confining at these normal atmospheric temperatures and pressure... that is what holds it together... supposedly. I certainly hope that this "story" is true.

What happens if you just keep squeezing?
Of course if you just keep pressurizing this material it may become a superdense superfluid and implode as a Bosenova... a phenomenon noted in the laboratory in Bose-Einstein Condensates . At vastly greater densities using "normal materials" instead of pure quantum materials they becomes successively... dwarf star matter, neutron star matter, quark star matter and finally a black hole. Of course you better not be standing beside it at that time according to some theories. According to others every sub-atomic particle is a variety of quantum black hole, this one is a special state that is a bit heavier than some, and that is somewhat safe to hold in your hand ... only it would be too dense to support it and would fall to the center of the earth. What it does there is nobody's guess. Out of sight out of mind... I hope?
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Re: Liquid to solid

Postby Good Elf » Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:14 am

Addendum: Another interesting reference regards water at high pressures is here:
PNAS wrote:Dynamic pressure-induced dendritic and shock crystal growth of ice VI
23 Oct 2005
Abstract: Crystal growth mechanisms are crucial to understanding the complexity of crystal morphologies in nature and advanced technological materials, such as the faceting and dendrites found in snowflakes and the microstructure and associated strength properties of structural and icy planetary materials. In this article, we present observations of pressure-induced ice VI crystal growth, which have been predicted theoretically, but had never been observed experimentally to our knowledge. Under modulated pressure conditions in a dynamic-diamond anvil cell, rough single ice VI crystal initially grows into well defined octahedral crystal facets. However, as the compression rate increases, the crystal surface dramatically changes from rough to facet, and from convex to concave because of a surface instability, and thereby the growth rate suddenly increases by an order of magnitude. Depending on the compression rate, this discontinuous jump in crystal growth rate or “shock crystal growth” eventually produces 2D carpet-type fractal morphology, and moreover dendrites form under sinusoidal compression, whose crystal morphologies are remarkably similar to those predicted in theoretical simulations under a temperature gradient field. The observed strong dependence of the growth mechanism on compression rate, therefore, suggests a different approach to developing a comprehensive understanding of crystal growth dynamics.

dynamic–diamond anvil cell
Downloadable pdf. Water is always the strangest and most atypical of any natural material known. Structures of "water" up to Ice XVI are "known" depending on the temperature and pressure environment (and there are many). It is almost a never ending quest... just a sample (1 MPa is about 10 atmospheres, most important point for us is a triple point around 273K, 1 kPa - note: log pressure scale)...
Image
Phase Transitions As A Metaphor for the Genesis of Complexity - Duke U
... it's a "metaphor" you see!
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